The Confederacy dissolved and the country was reunited. Early Civil Rights: Washington or Du Bois? In terms of memorials, one of the most exciting projects going on right now, which people might want to look into, is the Equal Justice Institute, which is an institute that does many things involving civil rights, and incarceration, and so forth, but one of the projects they started years ago was to document every single known lynching that took place in America from the end of the Civil War up to the 1960s. Again, you’re back to trying to stuff the genie back into the bottle and get things into a complete definition, and they don’t yield very easily to the convenient definitions. The monuments can be categorized in several ways, but include: • Union State, Regiment, Battery and Brigade monuments • Confederate State, Regiment and Artillery monuments • Monuments to Individuals • Monuments representing Union headquarters • Monuments representing Confederate headquarters • Other, such as those recognizing field hospitals, the memorial to Civil War women, etc. He fought for a cause that was fundamentally designed to protect and perpetuate and even expand slavery on into an endless future.” There’s a question about whether or not it’s appropriate to honor somebody like that now, regardless of the motivation that went into putting his statue up. The U.S. Civil War ended more than 150 years ago, but some Americans gather on old battlefields to re-enact this historic era in great detail today. Joe Dzikiewicz: Apr 25, 2000 12:00 AM: Posted in group: soc.history.war.us-civil-war: Hawk writes: >The next time you go to Richmond, Va you may see a glorious statue >of General Lee sitting on his horse Traveler. Live TV. The slave states were all in the southern US, giving them the name “the South”. The monuments built in honor of the Union (the north) are every bit as dangerous and impede black progress. His postwar career has both shadows and light. Southerners themselves, including the Ordinances of Secession in many of the Confederate states, said their number one reason for leaving the Union was to protect slavery. He’s not even thinking about poor white people in many respects. It was 1948, ’49, ’54, because that’s when the civil rights movement was gaining traction and it was becoming a national political issue about endorsing civil rights. Allen, your take on that? At that point, the whole idea of what particular individual it represents starts to get very vague it becomes a mass-produced thing, at which point specific means start to get very hard to pin on things. They make no distinction between Confederate and Union, abolitionist and pro-slavery, 15th-century figures and 20th. Another interesting option is to build competing or complementing narrative memorials. The 50th anniversary of the battle of Gettysburg in 1913, for example, drew over 50,000 elderly veterans to the site. Looking at the Census-designated subsections of the United States: New England (49% vs. 25%) and the Pacific coast (44% vs. 27%) are the most likely regions to say that the Confederate flag is a sign of racism over heritage. The Main Causes of the Civil War. Earlier this month, the last major Confederate monument in California came down.It was a curious one: a nine-foot granite pillar in an Orange County … These discussions are made all the richer by the scholarship of you and Ed. This time, even abolitionists and other anti-slavery figures have not been spared from the mob’s destruction. They formed the Confederate States of America, even before Lincoln became president on March 4, 1861. Following the war, slavery was outlawed everywhere in the United States. Is there a difference between the issues of Confederate statuary art and the issues that are attached to the memorials for Founding Fathers? There’s a time in which, as each era evolves, where people look differently at things because of our changed understanding of history and our deepening understanding of history. A lot of these popular insurgencies now and in the past have been driven by economic pressure and economic dislocation. It has statues of our brave boys and heroes of our area like George Rogers Clark and William Henry Harrison. That’s I think a way that I would choose to situate it. Their principal achievements are in founding the American republic, and creating a nation and creating a language, even if it was not quite intentional, like Jefferson when he writes, “All men are created equal.” He’s not thinking about slaves. It’s about establishing one’s own sense of moral purity in the present as opposed to an impure past. Some of those factors are going to be there. We have to remember those, because it’s only by remembering them that we actually gain the impetus to do the things that really are virtuous and right and noble. These include not only Confederate military statues and markers, but also their less-discussed counterparts on the Union side as well as a separate database of monuments to abolitionists and anti-slavery figures. Ralph Northam, though a judge on Monday issued a … The New York Times’s Nikole Hannah-Jones recently tweeted (now deleted) that it “would be an honor” if these incidents were named “the 1619 Riots” in reference to her error-riddled yet also prize-winning set of essays, the 1619 Project. That is a very, very big question, simply because there are so many statues that are erected in the post-Civil War years in so many different places serving so many different interests. The History of Confederate Monuments in the U.S. Confederate Bomb Plot. This period also overlapped with the Jim Crow era of state-enforced racial segregation, as well as successive waves of accompanying violence against African-Americans. If you went to South Carolina 10 years ago, you had to ask where to find it. The second National Flag of the Confederacy was issued by the Confederate Congress on May 1, 1863. Union monuments vs Confederate monuments: the numbers. The growing support for public commemoration of abolitionists and anti-slavery causes therefore signifies a clear and continuing shift in attitudes that has largely gone unnoticed from the monuments debate. The Great Courses: Can I ask you, Allen, to tease out a little bit about the difference that you see between memorial and monument? In some cases, these are people who are also doing this because they came back from the war, those who actually did manage to come back. When you play the thing out over time, when you play it out over location, when you play it out over the contestation of meanings, then suddenly the whole business gets very messy, and it’s not nearly so straightforward as people would like to say when you put it to a binary situation where it’s take it down, it’s evil, keep it up, it’s our life’s blood. If you read the documents, they’re pretty clear on that. These guys in Charlottesville are seeking to restore white supremacy. "Nowhere has the national re-examination of Confederate emblems been more riven with controversy than the Lone Star State." Although this narrative tapped “reunification” and a nationalist concept of the union, it was also intertwined with the elevation of the southern “Lost Cause” myth that intentionally downplayed slavery. Part of the whole point about whether or not a Lee memorial was erected as a symbol of white supremacy or fondness for remembering what happened during the Civil War, there are a lot of people that look at that memorial today and say, “Americans have been taught for more than a century that the Civil War was about states’ rights and about honor, and had essentially nothing to do with slavery.”. I cant seem to find a comparison of these 2 things. This is how messy it gets, and this is why the simplistic approach is liable to be the sort of thing that we wake up several years down the road wondering, “Why did we do that?”. An Interview with Allen Guelzo, Ph.D and Edward O'Donnell, Ph.D. The whole question about monuments, about memorials, about remembrance, these things are not mere historical footnotes. There’s a lot of debate about that, whether that actually accomplishes what it seems like it might accomplish. Iconoclasm’s about image smashing. About half a mile away at Monument and McPherson Avenues, a similar monument marks the spot where Union General John B. McPherson was killed by Confederate forces the same day. With the current politicization of statues, including multiple high-profile acts of vandalism against abolitionist and anti-slavery figures, it is important to stress this final insight from the data. Allen Guelzo: Absolutely. The problem is that the line between memorials and monuments isn’t really all that clear and distinct. The other thing is that between the 1890s and 1930, this is when the generation of those who had been in the Confederate Army is starting to die off. What I’m afraid of in the current environment is that in fact it’s not really a lot of thought. By contrast, Union-named schools happened at more or less a steady pace throughout this period. Allen Guelzo: Let me give you an even stranger case, and that is the Lee monument on the Gettysburg battlefield. He said, “We have lost. While the Union’s text began with “We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union […]” whereas Confederates deleted all references to “People of the United States” and replaced it with “We, the people of the Confederate States, each State acting in its sovereign and independent character […]”The willingness … There are confederate monuments, statues, and memorials in not just the south but in just about ever state. (Note: this chart excludes schools named after Abraham Lincoln, because they vastly outnumber any other Civil War-era figure on account of his popularity as a historical president. They want to erect monuments to their youth. image caption Democrats have called for Confederate monuments to be removed from Capitol Hill in Washington The second wave came in the 1950-1960s, as … I believe the inscription >just says "LEE"....actually there was nothing more to be said... Can >the Yankees match this? Today, do these meanings get down from their pedestals and walk around anymore? The question there, is what’s happening in the 1890s, the early 20th century that prompts people mostly in the South, but not exclusively in the South, to start putting up hundreds and hundreds of these monuments all across the South, some of them generic but some of them quite specific? Look at something like Bacon’s Rebellion in 1675-76, and many, many upsurges. The monument was designed 1914 by Moses Ezekiel, a Jewish Confederate, who wanted to correctly portray the “racial makeup” in the Confederate Army. Memorials of this type appeared sporadically in the 19th and early 20th century, with the most common examples consisting of historically black colleges and universities (HBCUs) that bear the name of an abolitionist figure or philanthropist. Union monuments substantially outnumber Confederate monuments in total, although the annual number of Confederate statues briefly overtook the Union totals in the cluster of dates around the 1911 anniversary. Twenty slave-free states and five border states made up most of the Union. Are there more confederate monuments as opposed to union ones in the country. There’s an additional multiplicity in the role of just public statuary art in general, because as Ed pointed out, you have the meaning that’s captured by the content of the statue, or you have the meaning that’s captured by the moment in which it was erected, but you also have the meaning in its persistence and current culture, which is I think part of what we’re grappling with now. There’s been a long history of insurgent groups. Grant’s not one of the greatest presidents, but Grant’s record in the early years of his administration are very impressive when it comes to pushing for equal rights, pushing for the enforcement of the Fourteenth and Fifteenth Amendment. When I hear that, that poses a problem for me, because I decline to recognize a definition of American beyond citizenship. Not only I think is the scorecard idea a good one, I also think there’s a question of looking at the landscape and saying, “What is here already, and what should be here in the future?”. There’s a sense that Southern identity is tied to national identity in a way that can’t be untied. The inscription at the bottom is, “To Virginia’s sons.” I haven’t got the words exactly, but it’s to the sons of Virginia, those who were from Virginia and fought at the Battle of Gettysburg. As the chart below shows, schools named after Confederate figures were at best sporadic and infrequent for the first 90 years after the war. The following transcript has been edited slightly for readability. Here in Indianapolis in the ce3nter of the circle downtown is the Soldier’s and Sailor’s Monument. Private Messages: Contact the Profile Managers privately: Mary Richardson, Terri Rick, US Civil War Project WikiTree, and Nae X. Ed O’Donnell: It’s all very complicated, as Allen was saying. The Confederate flag and monuments to Confederate leaders need to be removed from public property. The current debate over taking down Confederate monuments gives me a … As Union pensions grew at the federal level, southern states followed suit and began implementing similar expenditures on behalf of Confederate veterans, their widows, and their children. Allen Guelzo: You look at that period, 1890 to let’s say 1930, and the first thing that springs to mind of course is Jim Crow. If you look at the orders that he hands out, he’s giving out very conventional orders about repelling fugitive slaves from Union Army camps, about returning fugitive slaves to their owners. Ed O’Donnell: In some ways, I see that point, but I would draw the line, frame it somewhat differently, in terms of from the very beginnings of American history, we’ve had rebellion and defiance and small versions of radicalism have really been at the heart of American history. One of the most prominent Confederate monuments—the Robert E. Lee statue in Richmond, Virginia—is set to be removed by order of Gov. Confederate monuments have always been symbols of white supremacy. In this Torch episode, history professors Edward O’Donnell from College of the Holy Cross and Allen Guelzo from Gettysburg College move us through historical context, varying ideologies, and discussions of possible outcomes and solutions. 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